I have a good combo, but idk if it works how I think it does.
Asked by Redcat7264 6 years ago
I play a commander deck with Venser, Shaper Savant as my commander. If I have Crystal Shard and Paradox Engine on the field, and someone tries to get rid of lets say paradox engine. I cast Venser to prevent it, but what if they have a counter to that, can I then proceed to use Crystal Shard to return Venser to my hand and play Venser again to return that counter again? This would trigger paradox engine which would untap Crystal Shard, so basically what Im asking is could I use crystal Shard and Venser to basically counter everything that threatens my board even if they try to counter it repeatedly in the same stack?
buckeyetron says... #2
no, that doesn't work. if your opponent uses a counterspell targeting venser, its not on the field for Crystal Shard to return it to your hand. but once the venser is countered, it can go back to the command zone and then just be re-cast before the removal spell that was targeting Paradox Engine could resolve. if you have an additional 6 mana that is. thats another thing i think you're forgetting, is that you need mana to keep re-using venser.
April 10, 2018 10:16 p.m.
Redcat7264 says... #3
Thats where paradox engine comes in, I have a lot of artifacts that ramp, so no I wasnt forgettin
April 10, 2018 10:31 p.m.
Redcat7264 says... #4
Also, if I return a counter spell to there hand using Venser, can they then cast it again?
April 10, 2018 11 p.m.
Well, yes, as it's in your hand you'll be able to cast it, but as Venser removed it from the stack, it wasn't there to counter the first spell. The counter spell needs to actually hit the graveyard to counter anything.
Neotrup says... Accepted answer #1
So they do something to destroy Paradox Engine, then you cast Venser, Shaper Savant in response, triggering Paradox Engine's ability. They can try to counter Venser, Shaper Savant in response (or after the trigger resolves), if they do he will be put back into the command zone (or graveyard, if you have a plan that involves him being in your graveyard) and you can recast him after Paradox Engine's ability has resolved (or before, if he was countered with it still on the stack and you want to cast him before for whatever reason). You cannot use Crystal Shard as Venser was never on the battlefield and thus not a "creature," only a "creature spell" or a "creature card" depending on zone we're talking about (he was in a couple).
Alternatively: They go to destroy your Paradox Engine, you cast Venser, they let that happen, he triggers targeting their spell, they respond by trying to counter the trigger with something like Stifle. Now you can return Venser, Shaper Savant with Crystal Shard, as he is a creature, to either bounce the Stifle or let it resolve and bounce the original destroy spell, again.
Alternative 2:They go to destroy your Paradox Engine, you cast Venser, they respond by trying to destroy the Paradox Engine with a second spell. Now you're in trouble, as your commander is stuck on the stack. You definitely can't Crystal Shard a creature spell, but if you had something like Essence Scatter you could counter your own commander to get him off the stack and back into the command zone where you can recast him, though often times if you have a counter it will be just as able to counter the destroy spell as to counter Venser.
Alternative 3: They cast Krosan Grip (a fairly common commander card) on your Paradox Engine and you have no response, because very few decks are built to even be able to respond.
April 10, 2018 10:11 p.m.